equality
dreaming & making what could be, be.
in honor of martin luther king, jr. day, i thought i would post a little excerpt about dreams from my book, down we go: living into the wild ways of Jesus. it was originally inspired by a post i wrote in 2007 for the refuge blog called “we have a dream”; then i modified it in 2009 for communitas collective & shared a re-dux in 2010 in honor of MLK day two years ago. last year, when i was writing the book, it went through another revision. each time i read it i am reminded that part of making what could be, be begins with dreaming.
however, the kingdom isn’t going to just drop out of the sky. we are going to have to be active participants in creating it. it is hard. it is uphill. it is against the grain. but it’s possible. and what Jesus challenges us to as his followers.
so here you go, some of my own little church-faith-life dreams, capital letters and all, from pages 85-87:
Making What Could Be, Be.
As a dreamer, I like to imagine what could be.
Despite some of my cynicism about church systems, I am still an idealist. Change is possible; otherwise I would have given up a long time ago. I am still foolish enough to think that our wild “God dreams” are possible. I think when Jesus said “Your Kingdom come, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven” (Matthew 6:10), he meant that the Kingdom was possible now. I also know it’s possible because I see it every day in small and beautiful ways. I see the marginalized, forgotten, neglected and abused finding love and hope through healing community.
For a lot of us, it’s hard to dream. Almost every time I challenge people to dream it stirs up fear and trouble. We’ve hoped before and had many of our dreams dashed, mocked and called unrealistic or impractical. Many have tried to make their dreams a reality in systems that rejected them, and they’ve lost a lot of hope. The thought of opening hearts back up again is too scary. Others are in the midst of living out dreams and are finding how hard they can sometimes be. Often we can think of all the reasons our dreams won’t work, so why even try?
But here’s why I think we should try. These Kingdom ways aren’t supposed to be a pipe dream, or an elusive, unrealistic and unobtainable idea that we know will never happen. Jesus’ ways of upside down living require imagination and hope. They require crazy people willing to live out what’s embedded deep inside their hearts, regardless of the cost. They require courageous women and men who risk their money, time and pride to go against the flow of the powerful status quo and create little pockets of love that reflect Jesus, rather than the world. They require humble disciples, followers of Christ, who try as best they can to heal the sick, feed the hungry, care for the poor, love the unlovely, and pass on hope in places where there is none. Most of all, these Kingdom ways require people with eyes to see more beauty and hope in the often ugly, messy, downward journey than on the predictable, comfortable upwardly mobile path.
The other night I was with some Refuge friends at our house talking about dreaming. Even though I want people to dream big, I also want people to dream small. To value simple ways we can move toward more of Christ’s love, life and hope in this world. I shared with my friends how many years ago I dreamed of the kind of community I am now part of—one that was inclusive, authentic and healing, and valued generosity, equality and the practice of love, above all. In my dreams, it looked completely different. Trust me, it was a lot prettier, easier, bigger and brighter. Yet, even though my original picture was different, the flesh and bones of what I had hoped for has come true. I’m experiencing it in real life. I am grateful but also not afraid to keep dreaming for more. I want others to have a chance to taste and see, too.
So I keep dreaming, trying to play my small part in the bigger story.
When I stop and allow myself to really imagine, I dream that we’d be people who took Jesus’ words seriously. We can’t just talk about it, but we actually have to be forgiving, loving, sacrificing and humble. I hope we are people willing to give away our stuff, care for the widows and orphans, die to ourselves, hug lepers, love our neighbors, lay down power and make peace with our enemies.
I dream that all people would feel valued, regardless of our differences. I hope we become people who refuse to let color, socioeconomics, gender, theologies, shapes, sizes, or social abilities get in the way of seeing the image of God and respecting each other’s worth, value and contribution to this world. I hope we will continue to find ways for women, men, white, brown, poor and rich to work equally and fully alongside one other as brothers, sisters, leaders and friends.
I dream that the divide between “us and them” will continue to crumble.
I dream that Christ-followers will form into an underground army of advocates, that we will stand with the marginalized, oppressed, poor and unlovely, and will risk our pride, position and power so that someone with none could get a little.
I dream that damage from the past and present will not paralyze us from living out who God made us to be; instead, we’d use our story to help another person.
I dream a whole bunch of us will find ways to create little pockets of love in places that desperately need them so that we will be known by the world as “those crazy people who never give up on the hurting, the lost, the oppressed and the outcasts.”
Never be afraid to dream.
these are some of mine. what are some of your dreams, no matter how big or small?
it’s a helluva lot of people being influenced
when it comes to church, i firmly believe that the “best criticism of the bad is the practice of the better.” at the same time, i think it’s sometimes worth calling out its inconsistencies when it comes to the so-contrary-to-the-non-oppressive-ways-of-Jesus as a reminder and to gain resolve & clarity on why we feel so passionate about change.
yes, i recognize “the church” is a flawed system made up of imperfect human beings.
it also has an incredible ability to influence people. it possesses a wild amount of power to sway us certain directions. many often believe lock, stock & barrel what leaders say from the pulpit, TV screens, books, and most any other medium where someone is “teaching”. we assume the ones talking must know what they are talking about and just go with it.
their charisma is intoxicating. their clarity and certainty is comforting.
when it comes to issues of equality and inequality, this means a helluva lot of people are being influenced to believe in complementarian theology and practice. so many sit in the pews and nod their head when they hear about biblical manhood & womanhood and how men just need to step up and be the head of their households and women just need to support them properly. book after book gets written about this topic; the truth is that on the whole–the ones that sell like hotcakes–are those that adapt this hierarchical theology to contemporary culture in a slick, inviting way. don’t even get me started on mark driscoll’s new book & ed young’s new gimmick (i couldn’t bring myself to include the links).
but like it or not, people are listening. these guys are strong, clear, certain, charismatic communicators. and thousands and thousands and thousands of men & women are following them.
they are influencing a helluva lot of people.
when i was on a megachurch staff years ago we pulled together a really challenging premarital workshop that was egalitarian & honest & real. we tried not just to talk about budgets and the number of kids each person wanted. we shared from ephesians 5:21 (submit to one another out of reverence for Christ), the part of the passage no one ever starts with. i remember all those sweet young couples in there going “huh, i’ve never heard this before.” there were a lot of other things we explored together, but the point is this–the message was new and liberating. i am still proud that even for a short season we offered another angle.
a chunk of months after i left the staff i saw the premarital workshop being advertised again for the next round of soon-to-be-marrieds. the wording, the content, and the leadership had completely changed and the new focus was on exploring “biblical manhood & womanhood” and “God’s given roles for marriage.”
we all know what that means. yeah, it doesn’t go down too good for the women. or the men either, actually.
it broke my heart, but i wasn’t surprised. now, many years later, i feel sad when i think of the thousands of people being influenced by this usually subtle & sometimes direct teaching. not only in premarital workshops but in the daily grind of church culture where men are in charge, women are serving their butts off, and the power differentials Jesus tried to knock down continue to get perpetuated. mega-churches influence thousands of people. add the smaller churches who espouse the same theology and all of the books & seminars & bible studies being written and sold by people with power, and it multiplies exponentially.
it’s a helluva lot of people being influenced.
i’m sad for all the awesome women who are sincere and want to do the right thing before God and will read all kinds of books & go to all kinds of groups to learn to be a good christian women and always come up short. i know the feeling.
i’m also sad for all those men who will never be able to lead strong enough to be valid christian men and for all the ways they lose out on a strong and equal teammate.
mostly i’m just sad that many people don’t know that there are other options and ways to view the scriptures. i do not know one mega-church that actually teaches egalitarian marriage. i am sure they exist, but i believe they are very rare. many will say “we value women” and “we believe in equality.” but the truth is that deeply embedded in the cultural norms, teaching, and ethos of their bodies is a particular way of interpreting biblical roles for men and women that continually keeps women underneath men instead of in equal, free relationship with each other.
our best hope is to continue to be the change we want to see.
we can create smaller missional communities that teach a better way. we can play our part in restoring sexual brokenness and being people of change and hope. we can encourage women to lead more freely. we can model the beauty of equal marriage. we can blog our hearts out about equality and justice. we can learn how to bravely practice cross-gender friendships and write challenging pot-stirring books. all of these things are helping turn the tide, and that is beautiful. i may be a bit more skeptical than some, but i do believe major shifts are happening, and that’s always how we get to a new place. i think it can happen faster if more brave leaders use their power, influence, and charisma to directly influence change.
there will always be those who hold deeply to their interpretation of the scriptures that support male headship. i respect that. but there is a far wider population who only believe it because that is what their pastors, leaders, books, radio & TV shows, and podcasts tell them to believe. so many have never looked at it from another angle because no one in power has showed them another angle.
God, whether we influence a small amount of people or a lot of people, help us be brave and use our power & voices & lives to show another angle from which we can serve you and others better and actively participate in turning the tide.
Read Morerising up from below
* this post is part of the november synchroblog, different bloggers writing on the same subject. richard rohr says “the role of the prophets is to call us out of numbness.” right now there’s a strong sense of change brewing in the church, the world; people are rising up and calling individuals, communities, nations, and everything in between out of numbness and toward justice, mercy, equality, and love. bloggers this month are writing on where we are being stirred and challenged by prophetic voices. check out the links at the end of this post.
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“wake up, wake up, o zion!
clothe yourself with strength.
put on your beautiful clothes, o holy city of jerusalem..
rise from the dust…
sit in a place of honor.
remove the chains of slavery from your neck, o captive daughter of zion.”
isaiah 52:1-2
this scripture came to mind two weekends ago during our walking wounded gathering as i listened to two amazing women briefly sharing their painful church story of being silenced and unvalued in the church because they are female. honestly, in those moments, my heart physically hurts. i see their beauty, their power, their wisdom and wonder how in the $*!^$&^#%$ the church, the place that’s supposed to be Christ’s bride and a reflection of his image, could silence half its members so overtly (and somehow get away with it!).
the reality is that many other voices have been silenced by the church, far beyond only women. and because of this lack of voices, we have all suffered. we have missed the voices of the poor, the oppressed, the brown, the gay, the divorced, the orphaned, the young, the uneducated, the theologically incorrect, the tromped on, the forgotten. we have given our microphones and our pulpits and our programs over to the strong and the powerful and created a system where those on the margins are ignored and dismissed.
but something’s breaking out right now that can’t be squelched. we see it in the town squares that are filled with average people who are protesting wall street & starting to say “we’re tired of the powerful and greedy controlling our world, something’s got to change.” we see it in the mass exodus young people are making out of the church because it refuses to focus on issues they care about related to justice & mercy & equality. we see it in the long line of former-church-people who have deconstructed their faith & are finding something more real because they could no longer tolerate the deep inconsistencies between faith & practice. we see it in the groundswell of advocacy & support for equality and dignity for all regardless of sexual orientation.
in all kinds of places we are seeing it–a movement from below. a groundswell from the bottom. an uprising where little pockets of people are saying “we’re not going to do this anymore…..we’re tired of people’s dignity being stripped…it’s time for change.”
on the whole, the tops of systems aren’t changing. the hierarchy remains. the powerful and strong keep making rules & laws & policies & money. many are hunkering down, hoping they can weather this storm and eventually the unruly sheep will get back in line and start towing the line once again.
but it’s not going to happen. the sheep are getting tired of being jacked around by oppressive shepherds who don’t care about their well-being. who put their own self-interest above the common good. who allow others to be mistreated. who put chains around others necks instead of setting people free.
the sheep are rising up.
yeah, we’re rising up. not to rise up and away from problems and pain, but rather to have courage and strength to enter into it. all over the place, God is calling people to freedom, to living out the gospel instead of talking about it, to practice instead of theory. i call it a “holy stirring” and i think we will see it get stronger & wider & deeper over the upcoming years.
so many people i know are refusing to be part of oppressive systems anymore. they are finding their way outside of the traditional confines of religion & meeting God in unlikely places. they are renewing their passions and serving in all kinds of wild and beautiful ways that is viewed by the establishment as subversive even though it’s the closest thing to the gospel i’ve ever seen. artists are creating. silenced voices are speaking. young people are voting with their feet. chains are breaking. dignity is being slowly & painfully being restored in little pockets of love & freedom that are often unseen & unnoticed by the masses.
but it’s happening.
the prophets are emerging from below, from underneath, from unlikely places.
God is calling people out of numbness and complacency. and just like our hands feel when we warm them up after they freeze in the snow, it’s going to hurt. like really hurt. unfreezing our hearts, hands, feet, mouths, and brains is going to hurt as we thaw out and find our true identity created in the image of God. parts of us are going to come alive that were once left for dead. we’re going to have to use muscles that have atrophied. we’re going to feel things we haven’t felt before. we’re going to be more vulnerable and unprotected. we’re going to doubt our voices. we’re going to hear the critics tell us that we’re stupid & disgruntled & should quit complaining. we’re going to doubt ourselves and wonder if maybe “going back to egypt” will make it feel better.
some will go back to their “proper place” and feel safe again.
but far more others are going to keep waking up, rising up, and breaking free from the chains that once kept us captive. we are going to keep being set free and help others be set free, too. we are going to care about the things that Jesus cares about like justice & mercy & compassion & peace & hope & restoration. we are going to band together with others from below & form little armies of change that will shift laws & topple kingdoms & break down all kinds of walls that keep people stuck.
there’s a rising up from below, calling us out of numbness. calling us to freedom. calling us to justice. calling us to mercy. calling us to love.
God, keep thawing us out. we know it’s time.
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ps: i have a post up today at shelovesmagazine as part of a monthly column called sheloves God. this one is called leaving the ninety-nine for the one & is adapted from the chapter in down we go called extending love, mercy and compassion. sheloves is a prophetic voice calling us out of numbness in all kinds of ways.
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check out other bloggers writing about the prophets this month (i’ll add more links as they come in tonight):
- Joy Wilson at Solacetree- The Blessing of Losing Your Faith
- Jeremy Myers at Till He Comes – I Have a Dream
- Glenn Hager at Breathe – Uncomfortably Numb
- Linda at Kingdom Grace – On Earth as it is in Heaven
- Sally at Eternal Echoes – Where are the True Prophets?
- Tammy Carter at Blessing the Beloved – No Compromise
- Alan Knox at The Assembling of Church – My Word of Prophecy: Quit Listening to Prophetic Voices
- Liz at Gracerules – Listen
- Christine Sine at Godspace – Surrounded by Prophetic Voices: Clouds of Witnesses That Call Us Out of Numbness
- Amy Martin – The Window of Suffering, the Beginning of Hope
- Kathy Escobar at The Carnival in My Head- Rising Up From Below
- K.W. Leslie at More Christ – What is God Challenging You to Do?
- Katherine Gunn at A Voice in the Desert – Where is Your Heart?
- Steve Hayes at Khanya – Murder of the Cathedral
- Leah Chang at desertsspiritsfire – Wall Street, Our Street
- Bobby Aunder at Deconstructing Neverland – Shift
- Minnow at Minnowspeaks – Day of Dialogue
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little pockets of freedom.
we’ve been talking a lot about wounds from the church at the refuge in preparation for our walking wounded gathering, which is this upcoming weekend in denver. i am really looking forward to it & oh do we have some fun stuff planned! we still have a little bit of room if you want to come & haven’t registered yet, do it today.
as we’ve been preparing for it, it is has been interesting how much has been stirred up for me about church.
as you all know, i love the church. it would have been so easy for me to throw in the towel a long time ago if i had only based things on my experience with “the system.” but the truth is that God’s people–together in some way, shape or form, living out the ways of Jesus in real & tangible ways–is sewn into my skin in ways that i don’t think i will ever be able to shake.
at the same time, as much as i love the church, i also hate what it has done–and continues to do–to so many people. i can’t stand the way it limits people. i can’t stand the way it serves itself. i can’t stand the way it excludes. i can’t stand the way it reflects the powers of the world instead of the beatitudes-infused-kingdom-of-God. i can’t stand the way it puts programs over people.
my dear friend barb murphy is the founder and director of cans for hope, a grassroots ministry dedicated to raising money to help women heal from sexual abuse & sex trafficking. i heard her speak this past weekend at a ministry event & she shared something very powerful. she said “the things we can’t stand, we are called to fix.”
the things we can’t stand, we are called to fix.
out of almost everything related to “church” the one thing i can’t stand the most is how it limits freedom. i always say that the church of Jesus Christ should be the free-est, least oppressed, most inclusive, most grace-filled place on earth. yet, as we all know, it has the reputation for being the opposite. instead of being a pocket of freedom, many churches are pockets of oppression. limiting half of the population from leading freely. keeping God safely tucked into a man-shaped box. keeping gifts squelched and in the hands of the clergy. spending resources on perpetuating a system that has nothing to do with community & changed lives & healing & transformation and everything to do with mortgages & strategic growth. constantly giving into the gravitational pull toward comfort and making sure the powerful-people-who-give stay happy. assuming people only love God “their” way instead of lots of other wild & beautiful & untraditional ways.
this past saturday evening we talked about gender inequality and the church, and i left so sad (not because of the conversation, my daughter being on the panel sharing freely about this issue will inspire me for a long time!). my sadness came when i intersected yet again with the reality that on the whole “the church” is a terrible reflection of freedom when it comes to this huge issue of gender injustice. the world, with all of its cultural bias against the dignity of women, is actually much further along when it comes to embracing and valuing women than the followers of Jesus Christ are.
in the same way i think churches should just be little pockets of love, i think that pockets of love aren’t really possible without first being a pocket of freedom.
where all people have dignity & incredible value.
where no one is oppressed or silenced or considered less-than because of their gender or race or economic status or educational status or theology or any other things that usually keep people over or under another.
where questions are valued & doubt is honored because we trust in a God who can handle it.
where God is not contained by the limits of man’s teaching.
where each person’s gifts, no matter how big or small, have a chance to be expressed.
where men & women are seen as equals and sit next to each other as brothers & sisters & friends.
so that’s why i’m still in “church.” because the thing i can’t stand, i’m called to fix.
i can’t fix the whole big system. i know i can’t.
but i can refuse to participate in systems that knowingly perpetuate oppression. that’s a small & important place to start. it’s lonely at first, when we make a stand toward freedom, but it’s so worth it later.
and most importantly i can play my small part in fixing the little systems i am part of.
i can help create little pockets of freedom. for me, these are my family, the refuge & the different groups i am part of & the relationships that i am in. none of these are perfect; they are each made up of imperfect human beings, young & old ones, and i know everyone in them doesn’t feel fully free or fully loved all of the time. i don’t, either. we live this side of heaven so i don’t expect that. but regardless of our shortcomings, it’s still possible to play our small part in participating in creating the kingdom of God now by making spaces for freedom. real Jesus-infused freedom.
Jesus “sets the oppressed free” (luke 4:18) & i’m pretty sure this isn’t what he had in mind:
i’m also reminded again of what toni morrison says: “the function of our freedom is to free someone else.”
i hope that we can all bravely step into our freedom & quit letting man-made systems limit us. then, i hope we can use this God-given freedom to free someone else.
and someone else. and someone else.
yeah, a lot of little pockets of freedom, over time, can actually create big ones.
God help us play our small part in creating little pockets of freedom, a reflection of your kingdom in the here & now.
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a few other things:
- thanks david hayward at nakedpastor.com for the awesome cartoon.
- i think this is an awesome addition to the list of questions from the downward mobility synchroblog post last week. thanks jeff! // read it here: being loved or being used.
- i’m doing a down we go workshop this afternoon at soularize. if you’re there, come say hi!
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friendship, freedom & a lot less fear
“there is nothing on this earth more to be prized than true friendship.” st. thomas aquinas
uh oh, i’m on my “men and women need to learn how to be friends” kick right now. I think it’s appropriate in light of the shared leadership conversations, too, because it gets to the center of so much of what’s broken in our systems—both in and outside of “church.” we know how to be over others or under others, but rarely do we learn how to be alongside each other. yesterday a friend shared that when reading a blog post that someone had basically commented “well, i personally would never be alone with a woman because i can’t trust myself or her.” when i read this i felt sad for a few reasons: 1. it’s so common. 2. it’s so guided by fear, and 3. it’s so limiting. 4. it doesn’t need to be this way.
staying separated greatly limits our ability to be deeply connected in the ways i think God intended. we can’t learn some of the things we need to learn about life & love & people & friendship when we’re always living out of fear in relationship with one another. also, by keeping ourselves separated, we are perpetuating deeply grooved systems of hierarchy. in the end, we all lose.
the way to break down some of these divides is to learn how to be friends.
most of us haven’t learn this very well. a lot of our family experiences didn’t teach it. work often doesn’t teach it. many of our churches certainly haven’t taught it. so we’re sort of left to fend for ourselves and learn it on our own somehow.
against a lot of resistance. yeah, there are a lot of forces working against men & women learning how to be friends. patriarchy, sexual weirdness, negative church-messages & our own default-toward-not-knowing-how-to-do-healthy-intimacy-with-other-people all get in the way. my friend dan brennan talks a lot about this in his work on cross-gender friendships.
one of the reasons I feel so deeply dedicated to healing & recovery & the beatitudes & the 12 steps & transformational opportunities is that as we keep growing individually as human beings we can learn to be better friends corporately. it is true that when we have hidden addictions & are saddled with shame and insecurity & honestly just never learned how-to-be-a-friend-or-have-a-friend, we really can’t do these kinds of relationships safely, unless there is help & guidance. there’s just too much baggage that gets in the way. but, if we can find avenues for healing, we can start to break free from unhealthy patterns and learn how to do relationships differently.
in so many ways, i think that’s the big, beautiful idea of the spiritual journey—to become a better friend to ourselves, to others & with God.
the world needs people who know how to be good friends.
i think that’s what we are trying to learn in the life of the refuge community together. it is bumpy. sometimes ugly. and often scary. men learning how to be friends with men, women learning how to be friends with women, and men & women learning how to be friends with each other. to stop being “over” or “under” another but learn to be “beside”. across ages, life experiences, faith experiences, socioeconomics & a host of other differences. sometimes people say that they feel like they are in grade school, maybe even pre-school, stumbling and bumbling through learning how to be friends.
i love that idea because i think that’s what “church” is supposed to be—a place to learn. Jesus school. a container to be challenged. a safe place to practice.
to me, in another weird paradox, even though it seems stumbly & bumbly like pre-school at times, it actually is graduate-level work. and oh, so beautiful! to learn to be friends, real friends, is no small task. walking persistently with humility & courage is grad school stuff. real friendship, as Jesus reminded us, is “laying down our lives.”
over and over we will be humbled. we will be challenged. we will be afraid. we will make mistakes. we will need to give grace. we will need to receive grace.
but hopefully we will also laugh at our pre-schoolness & celebrate our victories & keep listening, learning, and growing on the journey together. i am so thankful for all i continue to learn through these deeper, healthier, scarier relationships with men & women, too.
i really don’t think living in fear was ever the idea. i think Jesus sets us free from captivity; the question is whether we are brave enough to try to step into it.
God, help us be brave & teach us how to be friends.
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ps: my friend john martinez, one of the co-pastors of the distillery church in new york, is doing a summer teaching series on down we go. i love their community & am so glad we’re friends across the miles. here are some posts about it:
- making a diverse, paradoxical, interdependent, with chain
- the kingdom isn’t going to just drop out of the sky
- casey anthony, we are really just like her
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some thoughts on co-pastoring, part 1
when i first started this blog over 3 years ago i wrote a little post about shared leadership that still gets a lot of play–why i believe in co-pastoring. it makes me happy that people are at least considering the idea enough to do a google search on it & read more about it. 5 1/2 years ago i had never even heard of the word. now, i’m in the thick of it & wouldn’t do it any other way.
for me, the words co-pastoring & sharing leadership are synonymous. some churches & communities use the word “pastor” & some may not. the idea, though, is the same–no one person “at the top”. at the refuge, we use “co-pastor”, so for the sake of this conversation i’m going to stick with that terminology.
today marks the start of a short blog series about the ins and outs of co-pastoring. it will include a couple of video interviews with my friend and co-pastor teammate, karl wheeler, who was the catalyst behind actually starting the refuge and co-pastoring together (more on that in a minute), an interview with our co-pastor team at the refuge (there are currently 4 of us, 2 men & 2 women), and some responses from friends of mine in different parts of the country who either have or are co-pastoring.
i know for some of you this isn’t the most exciting topic in the world and you’re just not that interested in church leadership. i hope you’ll listen in anyway, because some of these ideas might resonate, especially on why much of the leadership you may have experienced in the past didn’t seem quite right somehow. i also know that many of you are leading in your communities in different shapes & forms and are wanting to explore shifts in what that could look like. these posts won’t have all the answers & there are no formulas to follow. but my hope is to encourage & challenge others that a different way is possible–that the idea of one leader in charge of it all isn’t necessarily the only way even though that’s what it always typically looks like in most every church, most every organization.
i’m going to start with a video conversation with my friend & co-pastor teammate karl. there are two of them, recorded on my mac webcam with no editing, no big preparation, just a way to hear more of what we’re doing & what it’s like for us. without karl, the refuge wouldn’t exist. he’s the one who encouraged me to step into co-lead pastoring with him & plant this little crazy community 5 1/2 years ago despite the obstacles. we’ve been through the war together, from getting the crap kicked out of us together on a big church staff to slugging through what it means to lead this wild, diverse, poor little church with a huge heart for people. in different ways, we’ve both tried to quit, to run, to throw in the towel, but by the grace of God we continue to stay in. i think it’s because somewhere down deep we know we’re learning something that we can’t learn any other way.
yeah, i have no doubt that co-pastoring is a place where mutual submission, loving our neighbor, and leaning into being our own unique parts of the Body of Christ is put to the test.
so here we go, part 1 of a 5 part series on co-pastoring:
copastoring part 1 from kathy escobar on Vimeo.
as always, love to hear your thoughts!
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ps: i added a new page on the blog that shares a little more about down we go & also includes a video trailer that my awesome friend & fellow refuge-ee craig spinks of recycle your faith put together that shares a little more about what’s inside (it’s different from the downward mobility one). some of you already saw it on facebook but thanks for passing the link on to those you think might like this kind of stuff!
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